Talk:Learning Design/project/Design Decision Guide/Archive

Fee -

This is cutting edge stuff. I like the way you have integrated solid design principles for the wiki environment.

The approach is spot on - Questions with a supporting content rollover/link. Very smart.


 * hmm well lets see how it works when we get it to a testable stage --Fiona 07:44, 5 April 2007 (CEST)

I also like the phases - Begining, still discussing satisfied.

What did you have in mind with the editorial/QA phase? This will help me thing of the technical capabilities.


 * just thinking of what is required before you deem a page ready enough to "go live" ie. actually be used by those for whom it is designed. I know at the bootcamp, the last few days were spent doing final edits, for grammar, spelling, style etc. So that's really quite simply what I was thinking here...by members of the/a trusted group.--Fiona 07:44, 5 April 2007 (CEST)


 * Roll overs are a little more complicated to achieve in the wiki. Doable but will require more work. Lets check with Brent. I think this will need some javascript and suspect that javascript is not enabled at this time due to security concerns. - We always have the fallback of a boring link to the relevant support info. We'll think about this - its not a critical path decision for your work at this time.


 * The boring link would suffice - the important thing is having the information on hand to facilitate a decision.--Fiona 07:44, 5 April 2007 (CEST)

Wow - I'm impressed with you command of tables in the Wiki - its a horrible syntax.

--Mackiwg 05:14, 5 April 2007 (CEST)

A few additional thoughts ...


 * While drafting the next phases - it may be easier to omit the table formatting. We've got the idea on the first two phases, so perhaps it will be easier now to simple list the questions as text bullets to save you time and hassle.


 * Mercy! what a good idea . Actually, I only persisted to make myself experience the table thing.--Fiona 07:44, 5 April 2007 (CEST)


 * I've not focused on the specifics of the questions yet. First read is looking good - however, I want to spend a little time thinking about the questions.
 * Welcome - you have a much better idea of the spread of projects, and therefore the kind of guidance people might need. I did this fairly quickly so I'll give it more thought too.--Fiona 07:44, 5 April 2007 (CEST)

Using the Inputbox Extension to create LD Blueprints
Ok, so .. i'm going to start looking into using this extension: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:Inputbox which we have installed here on WikiEducator to allow users to automatically create an LD Blueprint outline which they can then start filling in. As we (Fiona and I) discussed the other day it occured to us that LD might actually be a good candidate for a real namespace to be created (need to ask Eric about the difference between a 'real' one and a 'faux' one). This way all the blueprints can be created under this namespace and a 'portal' page might be created to point towards some of them. This could be useful to others who are entering into projects for the first time. I'm going to run a test off of this page; when we get it right i'll move to the appropriate pages. brent 21:52, 28 April 2007 (CEST)

I've implemented a draft version of how this may work; see: Learning_Design/project/Design_Decision_Guide/Auto_Blueprint_Testing_Zone

What this does is to allow users to create a new Learning Design Blueprint that has an outline of what they need to think about and fill in to create a blueprint. The outline that i've included is taken from your existing design blueprint. There are two pages that you'll need to look at to work on this idea: Template:LDBlueprint and Template:NewLDBlueprintIntro. The LDBlueprint is the wiki markup that will appear in the editing area when someone starts a new blueprint using this method. NewLDBlueprintIntro is the text that will appear above the editing area, so it's for instructions, etc. So this is just a start; we should meet again to refine the idea, but basically i think this is a good start. brent 23:59, 28 April 2007 (CEST)
 * This is great Brent! Yes - can see it working. Actually, by being able to embed some of the 'questions' in the wiki syntax it also means you are  giving people those 'at the point of need' prompts and enabling the actual document page to be much cleaner and brief. I'll look at refining the questions and we should get together soon. Is this also your thinking about a start for progress indicators across the wiki? (boilerplate templates) --Fiona 01:40, 30 April 2007 (CEST)

Wiki Pedagogy
I read over what is being discussed here and I left scratching my head. I would not call what is being proposed as wiki education it seems more like traditional education in a wiki. All of the design templates look very similar to what I have seen in traditional learning design. I would like to challenge the group to innovate. I believe we need to envision a socio-constructivist approach facilitated in a wiki. We never really build a course, we build a journey that has students build their own course. This all goes back to the fundamental premise that the people who develop the course are the ones who have learned the most.

A few terms to get us started;

What is a wiki - is a website that allows visitors to add, remove, and edit content. A collaborative technology for organizing information on Web sites...

Things collaborative - The terms collaborative writing and peer collaboration refer to projects where written works are created by multiple people together (collaboratively) rather than individually...

Critical Pedagogy - cause I think learning does go back to the group that is trying to educate themselves, and the group of learners should decide how the learning progresses and should be empowered to overcome agendas that are incarnated in the traditional approach...

Wiki Pedagogy - cause we need to do something different. I just don't see the point in replicating traditional methods in a wiki. It comes back to; "The particular pedagogical challenge is one of control: wikis work most effectively when students can assert meaningful autonomy over the process." I suggest everyone read this site; http://www.profetic.org/dossiers/rubrique.php3?id_rubrique=110

I believe we need to have a template that guides every new learner, or group of learners (who become a cohort only because they are attempting to learn at the same point of time) they are collaborators due to showing up at the same time in the same subject area. They then self organize themselves and the content and create the same course all over again... in the wiki... our template would be more like a webquest (http://webquest.sdsu.edu/about_webquests.html) or problem based learning (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Problem-based_learning)...

I believe we have an opportunity to create a wiki pedagogy that uses social networking, web 2.0 and a true wiki philosophy...

I hope this kicks off a good dialog...


 * Hi Peter. I really like what you are saying. Infact – I think this is, believe it or not, exactly what inspired me to think of the concept of these design guides. I guess I believe there is nothing inherently wrong with the process of “traditional” learning design. The process should facilitate the design of “learning environments” - yes, a journey, not a course. The issue is ensuring that within the process, the right questions are asked and effective and possible solutions are made available. Ultimately people have to be comfortable with the decisions they make or the teaching and learning won’t happen, yeah? So this idea was to use the wiki to try to help “wikiEducators” go through a process whereby they would infact look more at the journey, than the course. And, indeed, the challenge is not only to try to facilitate good design, but to also guide groups to innovate as you say, in their teaching and learning. So…your input would be really interesting and most welcome.The questions that are here were thrown up really quickly so that we could test the wiki technology – (which seems to be proving possible).


 * Btw this is the template I’m editing: --Fiona 03:16, 14 May 2007 (CEST)

Phase 2: Understanding of learning need
When I read over this article and review the Learning Design Phase section I think these are a great set of questions, they should be asked of the learner every time they start a course. They should be answering these questions, for having them answer the questions will deepen their learning and make it completely applicable the them, their learning context, culture, language, it would have them seek examples, graphics, learning materials from their own community... An educational wiki; is a wiki; a community of collaborating learners... see previous section 'Wiki Pedagogy'...